Full spoilers for The Walking Dead's latest episode, "The Cell," continue below.
Daryl is not in a good place. After being taken captive by Negan, Norman Reedus' character was taken back to the Saviors' compound where he's been beaten, tortured and forced to eat a heck of a lot of dog food sandwiches. But he's still not broken, as proven at the end of the episode. He's still not willing to be one of Negan's men, even to protect his own life.
It's a complex situation for Daryl to be in, and one that offers Reedus a lot of juicy emotional material, especially coming off the brutal Season 7 premiere. I got Reedus on the phone to talk about the events of "The Cell," including Daryl's headspace after Glenn's death, what he thinks of Dwight and Daryl's connection and whether Negan will ever break Daryl. Check out the full interview below.
IGN: Looking back to the premiere, what do you think was going through Daryl's mind when he threw the punch at Negan? Do you think he had an expected outcome, or was it just an instinctual reaction?
Norman Reedus: He's sitting right next to Rosita, [who's] less than a foot face-to-face with [Negan]. After Abraham gets hit with the bat, he's got that bloody bat right in Rosita's face and he's taunting her. He's having fun with it. It's a big joke for him, and he's got the blood of Abraham on his bat and he's waving it in her face and she's crying and she's shocked, and I think he just couldn't take it. It was right in his face, and I think he just snapped. I think if he thought anyone was going to get retaliation for that, it would have been him. It would make sense that he hits him, he's the one who gets hurt. He never would have done anything that would have hurt anybody. He's sticking up for Rosita at that moment and he's sticking up for Abraham. Nobody saw what was coming next.
IGN: We see him deal with the emotional weight of Glenn's death in this episode, but how are you playing his emotional response to being the instigator of this event? Does he blame himself? How is he coping with that?
Reedus: He goes into episode 3, you see him, he's getting pushed down the hallway and pushed up against the fence and he's not fighting back. He's just taking it. I think he, at that moment, feels everything that's happening to him, he deserves it. He's so overwhelmed with guilt and sadness over his friends, he's just taking it. He's not fighting back at all. He's like, "I deserve to be here and I'm just taking it." Me personally, I never thought ever about, "Oh, I hope the fans don't blame Daryl or Norman." I never thought about that. The only thing that ever went through my head is "I hope Maggie forgives me."
That's the only thing that ever went through my head, to be honest, up until the Talking Dead premiere when Jeffrey [Dean Morgan] said, "Eh, it's all Daryl's fault!" He and I were in a van on the way to that show and it hit me, and I was like, "I wonder if people are going to blame me?" And he's like, "Aw, that's perfect. Everybody's going to blame you!" We got on stage and he's like, "It's all Daryl's fault!" And if you say that to a million people on TV, they're going to run with it. So I was like, "Mother f--ker, did you just say that?" But me personally, I never really broke the wall. I was always concerned Maggie would forgive me.
Every Death on The Walking Dead (So Far):
IGN: I hope we do get that eventual interaction between him and Maggie farther down the road. Building off what you said about Daryl feeling like he deserves everything he's getting, why didn't he just play along with Negan and say his name?
Reedus: Glenn was such an optimistic, good person and such a close friend of Daryl's that that's the last shred of dignity and hope that Daryl has at that moment. You can beat the hell out of him and feed him dog food and torture him, but if Daryl were to give that up he did it all for nothing. He has to have that to hold onto. "This is us. We are us, and this is our family, and you can't take that from me." It's a very heroic moment, but it's sad too. It's the last shred he has left, and Glenn represented that hope to all of us in the group. He was The Guy. He was the heart of that group. He was optimistic and had a good attitude and "everything's going to be OK, we can do this." He was that guy. When he's looking at that picture, he can't let that up. You can beat the crap out of him, but if he let that up it would be all for nothing.
IGN: I'm sure he doesn't have a longterm plan right now, but what do you think he thinks is going to happen next? Do you think he's expecting to die or do you think he's expecting to escape or be rescued?
Reedus: I definitely think he wants to escape. I definitely think he wants to kill a few people. I think that's pretty obvious. [laughs] Those guys have been through so much and Daryl's been through so much, I don't think he's giving up hope. I think his main objective right now is: get out of that room, kill at least two of those people that he has in mind. If they're going to kill him they're going to kill him. I don't think he's going to just wait and let that happen.
IGN: What do you think it will take to break Daryl and have him willing to submit? His comment to Dwight made it seem like he made his choice because he didn't have anyone to protect like Dwight had Sherry, but what happens if there does become someone else who's life he needs to protect in addition to his own?
Reedus: No, that's wrong. It's not that he has nobody to protect. You have Dwight going, "Why don't you just say you're Negan? Just say it! It's going to get worse. He's going to torture you. Just say you're Negan!" And he says, "Look, I understand why you did what you did, because you were protecting someone. It's the same reason I can't say I'm Negan." That's what that means.
I don't know what that would take [to break Daryl]. It's been such a hard year to shoot, this season. It's coming toward the end, and it's just been exhausting and it's just been full of tears and sadness. I've been told, "Hang in there." [laughs] You know what I mean? I was like, "We used to be so badass on this show! We were running through the woods shooting things and flying out of trees and stuff," and [Robert Kirkman's] like, "Just stick with it. You have to take a hero and you have to break him to his lowest point." I think that's kind of the theme of this whole season.
IGN: This episode leaned heavily on parallels between Dwight and Daryl. Beyond the obvious reasons for disliking him, what do you think Daryl sees in Dwight? Do you think he sees anything of himself in Dwight?
Reedus: I don't think he sees himself in Dwight, but I think Dwight sees Daryl in him -- or hopes to see him in him. When Daryl and Dwight first met, Dwight was a good guy trying to escape. He was trying to protect two people. People do crazy things out of fear. I know that he regrets a lot of his decisions. It kind of validates Dwight if Daryl will just say he's Negan and Daryl sees that, and Daryl won't do it. Daryl's not Dwight. There is a sort of bizarro thing going on here, but they're two totally different people.
IGN: Bizarro to the point that Dwight is walking around wearing Daryl's vest and everything. I'm like, "Stop your Daryl cosplay, sir."
Reedus: I've got to say, it is very hard for me to watch that happen. [laughs] That's my vest! That's my crossbow! You know what I mean? You see all these specials that they'll show us of throughout the years, and I'm like, "There's me and my vest. There's me and my crossbow. There's me and my vest. There's me and my crossbow." I'm talking to our showrunner and I'm like, "When do I get my stuff!" and he's like, "You're not just your vest and your crossbow." [laughs] And I'm like, "Yeah, but it's my stuff! Give it to me!" He's like, "You're not just that. Batman's not just his Batmobile." And I'm like, "Give me my junk back." It's very hard on set to watch somebody walking around in my stuff. It's very upsetting to me.
IGN: [laughs] I know I shouldn't be laughing, but that is really funny. I get that watching it! By the way, what were those dog food sandwiches Dwight kept making you eat made out of?
Reedus: It was like spam stuff, but with stuff in it, and it was on these rock hard rolls. It was just gross. Yeah, it's disgusting. It tastes like what I imagine dog food would taste like.
IGN: What do you think would be worse torture for Daryl: continuing to hear those songs on loop while being in the dark and eating dog food sandwiches, or Negan's other punishment: an iron to the face?
Reedus: I think Daryl's one of those guys that you can beat him up, you can really physically hurt him, but you cannot break him. I think the worst punishment for Daryl would be to take away his hope. I think if he was to say he was "Negan" and join that group, that would be the worst thing that he could feel.
IGN: Obviously Daryl isn't a character from the comics, but how much does your arc get to touch on some major comics storylines? It does seem like it's following a couple key ones so far.
Reedus: I don't know. I know that we're following the comics to a certain extent. Glenn's death was exactly frame-for-frame like it was in the comic book, and Steven [Yeun] even campaigned to keep that his death because I think a lot of the loyal fanbase of the comic book would have freaked out if that went to someone else because it's such an iconic death. The worlds are there. We're starting to introduce a whole bunch of worlds that are in the comic book, and there is parallels happening, and there's always twists and turns.
I'm not in the comic book, and I was told Dwight was created in the comic book sort of loosely based on Daryl after the show was already out. I remember when I saw the cover of the comic book, I went to Robert and was like, "You put me in the comic book! I'm so excited!" And he's like, "Nope." "It's just like me! It's got a vest! It's me!" And he's like, "Nope, not you." I was like, "Aww, man," because I really wanted to be in the comic book. We do sort of follow the comic book and veer so people don't know exactly what's going to happen.
How Negan's Big Kill Compares to the Comics:
IGN: I do want to talk to you a little bit about Daryl and Carol, two of my very favorite characters on the show -- especially together, largely because you and Melissa McBride have such good chemistry. Obviously they have been sent on very separate storylines and changed a lot since they were last together. So assuming Daryl gets out of the Savior's compound, what are you most looking forward to in a reunion between those two characters? Do you think, if they do see each other again, they'll be as good a support system for one another considering how much they have changed?
Reedus: I adore Melissa as much as Daryl adores Carol. It's great every time we get to do stuff together. I think it's pretty certain that they'll run into each other again, hopefully. But they're on different paths right now. Carol's doing her own thing. She's running away from the violence and the killing and doesn't want to be a part of it, and Daryl wants to rip Negan's and Dwight's faces off, so they're running in two different directions. It's great when Melissa and I have scenes together. I just like hanging out with her. I think she's great, and doing anything with her is fun.
Terri Schwartz is Entertainment Editor at IGN. Talk to her on Twitter at @Terri_Schwartz.
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